views:

600

answers:

8

I'm dealing with an outsourcing firm that refuses to provide a written letter of offer prior to my first day of work. To confound this problem, it's necessary for me to relocate for this position. Given the current employment market, I feel compelled to act, but it's starting to look like I should be searching for work elsewhere in advance of showing up for my first day.

It seems like this is a fairly common practice, judging from other posts. Is there any advisable action that I can take?

As a footnote, direct negotiation with the employer is always a great option, and worked in my case.

+27  A: 

I would not even begin to consider moving to an employer that would not give me a signed contract first, I would not even move for an offer. If they are not willing to give you a signed contract first I would run like hell to get away from them, that is HIGH on my sketchy meter.

As a business owner I would not even consider asking someone to relocate without a signed contract.

Unkwntech
+1 Run...far...away...now. Any above board company will pay at least some relocation expenses and will certainly give you a contract.
cletus
Agreed along with a contract I would expect them to pay some if not all of the relocating fees and I'm going to guess by the lack of a contract that they aren't.
Unkwntech
I wish I had this luxury! Hah!
yacdmnky
@yacdmnky if you don't then you need to find a better company. I don't think I need to expand that but remember that they want you, they should be willing to pay for you!
Unkwntech
+7  A: 

Sounds dodgy to me mate...

Perhaps you should continue looking? In a scenario like that I would also be tempted to chat to the client directly to fish around a bit and get a feel for what's really going on. Perhaps they can lay your doubts to rest.

Agencies... grrr.

Quoo
That's some pretty good advice, and I plan to act on it. They seem really keen on having me, so it might cause some action.
yacdmnky
+1  A: 

I wouldn't put too much confidence in a contract, as most employment contracts are "at-will", meaning the contract can be ended by either party, at any time.

Even with a contract, you could, hypothetically, show up for work, and at the end of your first day, be told your contract is being terminated.

If you have re-location costs, you could write a contract to that, along the lines of:

Employer understands that employee is incurring significant relocation costs, and agrees to pay relocation costs of $X,XXX if employment lasts less than 6 months.

abelenky
Although your comments about the termination any good contract with a decent company will pay severance, which is an incentive to keep you employed.
Unkwntech
Thanks. I don't feel like I have much in the way of negotiation latitude. There was a verbal mention of a nominal relocation package, but who knows what conditions they will create around it.
yacdmnky
Then don't take it, RUN LIKE HELL. You always should have negotiation room and there should be ZERO ambiguity.
Unkwntech
IANAL, but as I would understand it, "at-will" is in lieu of a contract. If the contract states other terms, they'd supersede the "at-will" part, unless the contract's terms are in fact illegal. "At-will" means there's no contract required or implied by law.
Kyralessa
Also, I think it's worth a few hundred bucks to talk to a lawyer and have him write up a contract just covering the moving part, along the lines of abelenky's last line. Either they'll sign it or they won't.
Kyralessa
+2  A: 

My previous job they wouldnt even agree to take me unless I signed the papers first so they could have everything ready for me when I arrived!

Can't aid you much. I would probably go ahead but I suppose it get's more difficult if you are head of the family or something.

mhenrixon
+6  A: 

I'd stay away. If they won't give you a contract now it means one of two things, neither good. As you indicate, it might mean they are sketchy. They intend to shaft you or at least leave open the possibility of it. The other, more likely, reason is that they don't have a contract available. They are too disorganized to do so. If that's the case, your employment is probably safe but I have to wonder what the work environment would be like. In either case, I'd stay away if I had any other options.

Another thing to consider is what they'll ask you to sign once you get there. All sorts of annoying things could be in a contract like an onerous non-compete or rights to any code you create any time, restrictions on your off-the-clock activities, etc. It would suck to relocate only to find you don't want to sign.

Steve Rowe
Excellent second point, although there are plenty of other reasons why there might not be formal contracts available to sign. In fact, the best places I've worked at have been "handshake" agreements, rather than formal contracts.
womble
+1 for the second point!
Unkwntech
+1  A: 

Can they pay for part of your moving expenses or some type of signing bonus as a sign of good faith? They're still not obligated to hire you, but you'll feel better about the situation.

Jeff O
+6  A: 
Given the current employment market, I feel compelled to act...

By all means act, but act rationally. No contract == no job! Act in your own best interests - tell them you'd be happy to accept the position as soon as you have a formal offer in writing with specific relocation reimbursement/expenses, in the meantime keep looking for work with a firm that respects you and doesn't expect you to take all of the risk. If they don't want to pay relocation then do not relocate yet. Instead, ask them to put you up in a hotel for the first 2 weeks (or do it yourself, weekly efficiencies are about $150/week in some areas) and see how it goes. You may hate this job, especially if they are so disorganized or disrespectful as to not make a formal offer.

If you still feel that you absolutely must accept this job, go ahead - but don't relocate, just visit, until you're sure of their intentions - and ability to pay regularly!

Steven A. Lowe
Good, solid advice for the specific circumstances.
Rob
A: 

They might have a trick in mind. Some developers are very reluctant to sign anything like non-compete agreement or when a company lays claim on whatever you do also in your private time, so as to secure themselves or make sure the employee does not sped his mental powers on side projects.

Unwillingness to offer you a contract before you relocate could have intention of leaving you without negotiation option because you have already committed to the path and relocated.

User