How long would it take a non-programmer to learn C#, the .NET Framework, and SQL?

Question

I am not that good at programming. I finished my masters degree in electronics. I want to learn C#, the .NET Framework, and SQL. How much time do you think it would take (if I have 5 hours a day to devote to it)? Also, what order do I learn them in? I have Visual Web Developer 2008, is that enough to begin?

Copied from a new question by the same user:
I should have specified that I wish to make a career out .NET Development. I'd like to give myself 2 months to get the 'basics' down. As a developer, what is expected out of you in IT companies? What skillset do they require and what are the responsibilities as a junior or mid-level developer? I don't have any industry experience, will I be able to get a feel of the job duties while at home?

Answer 1

It really depends on what you mean by "learn". You could probably spend a week and get a couple of pages up on the web that had some minimal level of interactivity to save information entered by the user in some database, and then have some other pages for querying and displaying the information. You could then spend the next 10 years of your life learning all the intricacies of the .Net framework, SQL, and mastering using the IDE.

Answer 2

If you have any programming experience, you can probably learn the C# syntax in a few hours, and be comfortable with it within a week or so. However, you will not be writing complex structures unless you write a lot of code with it. It's really the same as learning any language: you can learn all the words and grammer fairly quickly, but it takes a while to be fluent.

EDIT

A book you may want to pick up for learning C# is C# in a Nutshell (3.0) which I found to be very useful, and has been recommended by several people here.

Answer 3

The period of which you are capable of learning really depends on your ability to grasp the logic behind programming while where to learn from depends on your learning style.

If you are a learn-by-a-book type of guy, just jump on Amazon.com and perform a quick search, pick up the book with the best reviews or wait for someone here to recommend a book (I'm not a programming by book guy)

If you prefer screencasts (video feeds demonstrating what to do) or tutorials, then go straight to the source: http://www.asp.net/learn/. There are tons of videos and tutorials explaining everything you need to get started.

Visual Web Developer 2008 Express should be all you need to get started. Basically, the express editions are Visual Studio chopped down to a precise set of functionality to accomplish one thing. They don't have some of the bells and whistles needed for large scale development, but everything you should need.

Answer 4

That's like asking how long it would take to learn French:

• 1 day to learn what it is
• 1 week to learn it to an infant/elementary level
• 1 year to be considered a beginner by professionals
• Several years to be considered an experienced professional
• Plus there's "deep" knowledge of those subjects which a mere mortal such as you or I will never learn

Then again, plenty of people (most normal people, non-programmers) never learn those subjects, so if you're like "most" people then the answer would be "it would take forever" or "it will never happen".

Answer 5

Well, it will take you forever. There is so much to learn about programming that 10 years are not enough.

http://norvig.com/21-days.html

Don't get me wrong, you will learn the basics quickly enough, but to become good at it will take much longer.

You should focus on an area and try to make some examples, if you choose web development, start with an hello world web page, then add some code to it. Learn about postbacks, viewstate and Sessions. Try to master ifs, cycles and functions, you really have a lot to cover, it's not easy to say "this is the best way to learn".

I guess in the end you will learn on a need to do basis.

Answer 6

Just do it! Don't sweat the details.

Answer 7

Can't tell how long it would take, it really depends on your existing knowlege. I managed to learn the C#/.NET 2.0 core basics in about 2 months. My suggestion to you: Try to learn towards exams, they make sure your learning covers all important parts and also guide you through this new technology. See Microsoft Learning.

Answer 8

I'm not flaming, but starting out with "I am not that good at programming." well, why are you going to get involved in this then? It's not a small commitment.

Answer 9

How long is a piece of string? I think this is subjective. I know programmers that have learned an extraordinary amount in a very short time based on the experience that they've exposed themselves to.

Basically, get your hands dirty and you're bound to learn more.

Answer 10

The answer in my view is related to whether you have a tangible problem to solve or if you just want to learn for example to be prepared for a possible new job. If you have a problem then you are in better shape. You can start by looking around and seeing how other people went about solving that problem. Languages in general you should be able to pick up fairly quickly (after all you hold an MS in EE, no small feat IMO).

What you need to be on the lookout for is good programming practices. You'll probably see yourself asking "why is this method so small", "why is this method empty and what the heck is this abstract word doing here". That will give you perspective beyond syntax towards good writing.

Answer 11

Dive right it, make it a hobby, and have fun :)

Coming from an electronics background myself I can tell you that you should pick it up pretty quickly. And having an electronics background will give you a deeper understanding of the underlying hardware.

IMHO the root of information technology is electronics.

For example..

Think of objects as components.

The .NET framework is essentially drawers full of standard components.

For example you know what a 7400 (NAND gate) is capable of doing. You have a data sheet showing the pin outs and sample configurations. You don't typically care about the circuitry inside. Software objects are the same way. We have inputs and we have methods that do something to the inputs to produce predictable outputs. As developers we typically don't care how the object was written... just that it does what it says it will do.

You also know that you can build additional logic circuits by using two or more NAND gates. This of this as instantiation.

You also know that you can take a NAND gate and place it inside a circuit where you can modify the input signals coming in so the outputs have different behaviors. This is a crude example but you can think of this as inheritance.

I have also learned it helps to have a project to work on. It could be a hobbyist project or a work project. Start small, get something very basic working, and work up from there.

To answer your specific question on "what should I learn first".

1) Take your project you have in mind and break it into steps. For example... get a number from the user, add one to the number, display the result. Think of this as your design.

2) Learn basic C#. Write a simple console application that does something. Learn what an if statement is (this is all boolean logic so it should be somewhat familiar), learn about loops, learn about mathematical operations, learn about functions (subroutines). Play with simple file i/o (reading and writing text files). The basic C# can be thought of as your wiring and discrete components (resistors, caps, transistors, etc) to your chips (object).

3) Learn how to instantiate and use objects from the framework. You have already been doing this but now it's time to delve in further. For example... play with System.Console some more... try making the speaker beep. Also start looking for objects that you may want to use for database work.

4) Learn basic SQL. Lots of help and examples online. Pick a database you want to work with. I personally think MS Access is a great beginners database. I would not use it for multi-user or cross platform desktop applications... but it is a great single user database for Windows users... and it is a great way to learn the basics of SQL. There are other simple free databases available (Open Office has one for example) if you don't want to shell out $ for Access.

5) Expand your app to do something with a database.

Answer 12

If you want to learn, REALLY want to learn, then time is not of consequence. Just move forward everyday. Let your passion for this stuff drive you forward. And one day you'll see that you are good at C#/.NET.

Answer 13

According to Malcolm Gladwell, it will take you 10,000 hours to get really good. So get cracking.

Answer 14

When I switched careers out of Finance, I took 9 months off to study C++ full-time out of a book by Ivor Horton. I had a lot of support from my best friend, who is a guru, and I had been programming as a hobby since high school (I was 36 at the time).

It's not just the syntax that's an issue. The idea of things like pointers, passing by reference, multi-tiered architectures, struct's vs classes, etc., these all take time to understand and learn to use. And you're adding to that the .Net framework, which is huge and constantly evolving, and SQL, which is a totally different skill set than C#. You also haven't mentioned various subsets of the framework that are becoming more widely used, like WPF, WCF, WF, etc.

You're an academic so you can definitely do it, but it's going to take serious effort for a long time, and you definitely will need some projects to work on and learn from. Good luck to you.

Answer 15

Simple answer: a lot longer than two months. Learning to program competently will take longer than that, no matter what. It took me years to learn to be a competent object-oriented programmer, and I'm good at this stuff.

More detailed answers: it doesn't really matter whether you learn C# or SQL first, as they're very different. I'd probably suggest SQL, as it's easier to learn and more independently useful.

You will have a hard time getting used to the on-the-job realities at home, much as if you were studying plumbing or quantitative finance.

You're going to have a hard time putting all the information together without one or more projects you try to do. You're going to need to have other people to tell you when you're being stupid, when you're being overclever and will pay for it later, and when you're actually getting it.

Try to find an open source project you find vaguely interesting. Study their code. Figure out why they do what they do. Look at the bug list, and try to find something as trivial as possible to fix. Work from there. Learning to contribute is going to teach you things that are useful in the work world, and it will give you something to point at. It will be far easier to get your first job if you have some experience to point to.

Answer 16

All "relativity" aside, not fast. Based on the fact that you said you never programmed before...to become a basic programmer, a few years.

And to become a good to outstanding (using design patterns and industry recognized standards that relate to common standards as defined by ISO/IEC 9126 Standard such as testability, maintainability, etc.) programmer, it takes years of experience and coding often.. you do not become "Sr." or an "Architect" overnight and the same thing is true for a mid-level developer who doesn't code slop.

It's always a process where you improve. So learning is relative. But to learn the basics, seems simple until you start to design classes and interfaces. And even Leads stumble on the basics..doing things wrong. Everyone does. There is so much to be aware of.

If you're just going to be adding features (using classes your Lead or Architect has stubbed out for the team) and not really adding new classes, etc. it's easier....but you should take care in coding using standards and you still have to know complex areas of OOP. But that's not really OOP. When you start to creating classes, interfaces and knowing about inheritance, heap, references, etc. yada yada...and REALLY understanding it takes time no matter how smart you are or think you may be.

So, for a new programmer. Not easy. Be prepared to code a lot. And if you are not, find a job where you are. It's all about coding as much possible so you can get better.

Read these books FIRST. Do not dive into any others out there because they are not geared toward teaching you the language in a way you can get up to speed fast:

http://www.amazon.com/Head-First-Object-Oriented-Analysis-Design/dp/0596008678/ref=pd_bbs_sr_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231280335&sr=8-4

http://www.amazon.com/Head-First-SQL-Brain-Learners/dp/0596526849/ref=pd_bbs_sr_7?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231280335&sr=8-7

http://www.amazon.com/Head-First-C-Brain-Friendly-Guides/dp/0596514824/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231280393&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.com/First-Design-Patterns-Elisabeth-Freeman/dp/0596007124/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231280393&sr=8-3

they will get you the fasted jump start into understanding, better than any books out there.

Also for these lame type of responses, ignore them:

"Then again, plenty of people (most normal people, non-programmers) never learn those subjects, so if you're like "most" people then the answer would be "it would take forever" or "it will never happen"."

Those come from developers (typically leads) who have some Ego trip that DON'T want you to learn. Everyone learns differently and at different paces and eventually you will become "fast". I get very tired of hearing Sr. developers say statements like this when their sh** also stinks many times no matter how good they are. Instead they should be helping the team to succeed and learn as long as their team is working hard to keep abreast and doing what they can on their own as well (not leachers).

Make sure you try to get a Jr. Level Developer position first...

Answer 17

The best thing about C# is that it is very catchy. Easy to pick up, and you'll also have fun doing it.

But .Net framework is a very big library full of wonderful things to discover, and yet again due to the nature of .Net you'll also have fun learning it. It's a coherent, object oriented, well documented library, and C# makes it so simple to work with it that you can simply discover your way through it while coding.

The vast majority of articles, books or resources about .Net and C# simply concentrate on explaining functionality and the framework and far less about how to avoid quirks, workarounds or exceptional cases, like it happens with other languages I don't want to name (*cough C++*) so in the end the experience of learning C# and .Net is very enjoyable from start to finish, and the things you can accomplish using .Net also makes it very rewarding.

You picked a good language to start with, in my opinion, and finally to answer your question, it will take you about:

• 2 to 3 months to learn the basics
• 1 to 2 years to become a versed developer
• 5 years or more to become a expert or, depending on your dedication, a "guru".

But then again, beating the numbers and breaking the limits lies inside human nature. Can you do it faster than this? ;-)

Answer 18

2-3 months to learn the basics...no way. Unless you're gonna code spaghetti sure. Same goes for the 1-2 years. Spaghetti it is then..

Answer 19

You'll pick up c# fairly quickly (the language syntax is not that complicated). It will take you a long time to really learn the .NET framework, but you'll pick up the heavily used parts of the framework fairly quickly, and you should start seeing patterns in the framework.

My advice to you: don't just learn from a book or website. They will teach you the language and framework, but they will not teach you how to program anything useful.

Writing little code snippets will teach you how to do a very specific tasks, but they do not teach you how to write applications. My suggestion is that you think of an app that might be fun to work on (and doable... e.g. don't think that you're going to write an operating system or crysis or something in a month or two). Personally, when I was learning, wrote my own full featured IRC app, complete with rich text, personal messaging, etc.

Answer 20

Build on what you already know and have a look at lot of job adverts. E.g I have seen jobs asking for WinForms/WPF AND electronics for the writing of a UI to control a custom bit of hardware.

You may find the “robotics” .net toolkit interesting.

.Net is now too big for anyone to learn both WEB and Desktop so you have to decide the way you are going to go. Web has lots more jobs, but there are very few people with good desktop stills.