Does HTML5 mean the end of "rich" closed source programs for the web?

Unlike Flash, if you develop an application in HTML5 using Canvas, since it uses JavaScript, doesn't that mean the code is wide open? Does using HTML5 mean the end of closed code on the web browser? Am I correct that a Flash application has a closed source?

I know that HTML and JavaScript has been open for a while (just view source right) but I thought really rich applications like in Flash had hidden source code. For those creating in Canvas and HTML5, doesn't that mean the end of hidden code for "rich" applications? And maybe losing money because of it?

edit: not trying to argue but hacking the code by decompiling or reverse engineering it is not what I mean. That code is not open by default. The person that makes something with HTML5 and canvas and JavaScript knows their code will be open. Perhaps this is a reason for many to stick with closed apps like Flash, Silverlight, etc. I don't know.

I am assuming that by "closed source" you mean that the source is not visible using "view source" rather than that is is not "open source licensed". If you meant the latter, you can let other people see your commercially licensed (closed source) code if you like. See Microsoft's Shared Source for example.

Just like JavaScript, I would expect a lot of real world HTML5 to rely on server side data and processing.

If you look at any of my pages, you can see all the JavaScript code but you will notice that a great deal of it is just making AJAX (or AJAJ) calls to somewhere else. Everything else is just display magic like turning buttons of class 'linkbutton' into links. If I wrote a chess app in HTML5 canvas, you could see the UX work but you would still not know how my AI engine worked.

That said, I am sure a lot more code will end up visible. Just not by people who do not want it seen.

As noted elsewhere, things like Flash and Silverlight can be decompiled.

UX = User experience

AI = Artificial intelligence

But it's not open like "view source" which is what I meant. Open by default.

johnny 2010-09-13 16:28:35

@jonny - And as a consequence, Flash is nowhere near as popular as HTML/JavaScript. Open is good.

Coronatus 2010-09-13 16:35:47

@coronatus This is your second repsonse on this. I did not say that all open is good or that all open is bad. There is a time however for a non-open piece of software. I do not agree that all software should be shared with the world..anymore than every company should divulge company secrets, if it doesn't want to.

johnny 2010-09-13 16:55:37

@johnny - What does it matter if I've wrote two comments? They were about two different things. Actually *your* comment above is completely irrelevant to mine.

Coronatus 2010-09-13 17:24:26

@cotonatus - they are not personal attacks, firstly. Second, your comments look the same to me...it's as if it's wrong to hide your property and make money off of it and keep others out of it.

johnny 2010-09-13 18:03:38

@johnny - First, nobody said anything about personal attacks. Second, hidden source does not prevent copycats -- Google, Microsoft, Yahoo, and dozens of others all have similar products, usually with closed source.

Coronatus 2010-09-13 18:16:42

Yes, you can but someone can still see your "technique." something that may have eluded a company's best programmer until you showed them the light.

johnny 2010-09-13 16:29:29

If it's that important, you should patent it -- copyright doesn't protect techniques very well anyways. You can't copyright-protect a mathematical formula or an algorithm.

Radomir Dopieralski 2010-09-13 16:32:59

To extrapolate: The fact that your code is visible makes it more likely to be pirated. Legally, your code is still yours. The burden of protecting your property, however, still rests on you. Given the size of the internet, this is no easy task. The moral of the story: If you're lazy, open source it. (I'm lazy).

Ryan Kinal 2010-09-13 16:33:28

@Johnny - So? Nobody would know anything about any programming language if the language's creators and first implementors hadn't helped others learn. It's how the world works.

Coronatus 2010-09-13 16:34:37

@johnny There are no such "secret techniques" in programming. Given any user interface, a half-decent programmer can implement the code required to duplicate that interface. If your company's best programmer can't, then he is in the wrong job.

meagar 2010-09-13 16:48:51

@meagar - Although that may be true (I agree that it is), the result may not be as fast, secure, robust, extensible, portable, etc. So, while I think that "secret techniques" is maybe an overstatement, I would say that many businesses would not necessarily want the competition to see how they do what they do. Programmers do differ in talent and experience. All that said, I believe in the "standing on the shoulders of giants" nature of progress and am a big fan of open Source.

Justin 2010-09-13 16:57:04

@coronatus - not all software should be open. I simply disagree with that premise or that it's how the world works.

johnny 2010-09-13 16:57:39

@meagar I am a big fan of open-source too but not for everything (not saying you said that.)

johnny 2010-09-13 16:58:46

@johnny Nobody said that all software should be open-source. Your code belongs to you (or your employer, depending on the contract) and there are laws that guarantee you that. You are not required to apply complicated cryptographic solutions to keep your program closed-source -- actually you don't need to do anything, it's closed-source by default if you don't say otherwise.

Radomir Dopieralski 2010-09-13 17:14:39

@johnny - Then you should erase your memory of everything you have ever been taught by other people (how to read and write, etc) and teach yourself. Either that or you are wrong.

Coronatus 2010-09-13 17:23:11

@coronatus - then you should pay a dollar to everyone you have learned from and we'll be even.

johnny 2010-09-13 18:02:28

@johnny - I'm not the one complaining about visible source, you are. I've pointed people who ask me questions to the Javascript I write.

Coronatus 2010-09-13 18:15:19

I meant you can see it via open source and therefore anyone can copy it even though you wish they wouldn't.

johnny 2010-09-13 16:53:39

@johnny - I still understand you to mean 'visible source'. When you say, 'open source' my brain understands something completely different - http://www.opensource.org/

Justin 2010-09-13 17:01:26

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Does HTML5 mean the end of "rich" closed source programs for the web?

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