Where are all these entry-level jobs in Computer Science that I keep hearing about?

Question

I'm assuming I'm not the only one with this question:

Every week or so I hear about some new Industry honcho talking about how nobody majors in Computer Science any more, and how there are many more positions available than there are grads to fill them, despite the economy.

So where are these entry-level jobs that I keep hearing about but never find? Is this all a bunch of hooplah made up by CEO's so they have a bigger pool to choose from?

I'd be happy with just about anything at this point: a government job, a small startup, a junior job at a large corporation... however, Craigslist and Monster just turn up a meager assortment of IT jobs that ask for 20+ buzz-words that no college student will ever pick up, as do the career sections of corporations' websites.

What do other CS grads do? Move to Silicon Valley? Am I looking at the wrong websites? I had assumed that graduating with a CS/Math degree and a high GPA in a sizeable city would snag me a good job, but I can't even find any entry-level jobs to apply to. I go to a small college so there aren't really decent career fairs. (Also, I'm in the Twin Cities, if anyone knows about the scene here!) ;)

Answer 1

Most of the major companies that have entry-level jobs hire directly through school career fairs in the top engineering schools. Without the career fairs, in a bad economy, it's not easy. If it helps, I'm graduating with a Ph.D. and have the same problem since I don't have all the buzzwords either.

You may want to get in touch with recruiters in NY who hire for the hedge funds. If your math and classic CS (algos) are good, you may actually stand a better chance there.

P.S. Major company honchos only say that there are jobs they can't fill so that it is easier for them to lobby congress for increases on the H1B quotas. The best way to keep employees sweating for you is to string them along with the hope of a green-card one day. If you lose your job, you and your family immediately have to vacate the US, and there's nothing like that fear to keep you working hard and not looking for other employers.

Answer 2

In addition to career fairs and college recruiting, you might also want to try directly applying to software companies through their online websites.

Answer 3

Many companies know that most of the applicants don't fit - not because of lacking some buzzwords but because of bad attitude, lack of passion, not being able to program and other reasons.

That's why they try to not advertise jobs that require only a few buzzwords - they are afraid of the resume pile. They instead search for resumes themself or participate in career fairs. This way they have better odds to find suitable freshmen in shorter time.

Your options are therefore the following: career fairs (especially on-campus) and publishing a resume on a job-search site.

Answer 4

It's about strategy. People always respect initiative.

Set yourself up as a consultancy business. This means create a website, think about the services you can offer, maybe even do some work for free (while you are not employed elsewhere). However keep applying for jobs. When you apply include a link to your website on your resume. When employers look at your website, they get the feeling you are someone who can hit the ground running, take initiative and don't need to have your hand held through the first few months.

Answer 5

Try looking at other options such as small retailers or web dev companies that might need someone on board.

Also, try proactively sending out your resume just in case there is a job opening.

Answer 6

Well, you could always move to India!

In all seriousness, I can tell you that it's extremely difficult to find a real, honest to goodness, high-quality programmer amidst the masses of graduates who went into computer science simply because they heard that this is where the jobs are.

I'd like to tell you that if you know your stuff, people will recognize it and want you to work for them, but in reality the top tier of coders still often gets passed up for those who only know how to interview well.

I'd say, beyond the obvious bits of getting the word out, and making connections wherever possible, it's critical that you sharpen the hell out of your interviewing skills. Practice speaking and explaining till you have the confidence of a talk-show host. Explain complicated subjects to your friends, and make them interested; learn to watch for body language and adapt what you're saying to make them want to listen. Learn to listen to others and make them feel like you're interested in what they're saying.

And second, build something. Anything. Create an open-source project that mirrors the sort of thing you want to work on for a living. Build a photo-sharing site or an iPhone app, or whatever. If you have something to point to at an interview and say "I made this", then it puts you in a completely different class of job hunters. People out of college are a risk because they're not experienced -- they haven't built anything in the real world, so employers don't know how they'll really perform. Show them they don't have to take a chance when they hire you; they'll already know what they're getting because they can just look at the quality of what you've created.

Answer 7

I broke into the industry in the last 2 years as a psych grad actually(former comp sci, but I have been programming my whole life so it doesn't really matter).

All you have to do is find a low paying/no paying internship at a local company. Try craigslist, or find all the development places around the city and email/visit them with your resume/cover letter. Expect to be tested during the interview, I had to program stuff on the spot on a big projection screen while a bunch of people watched. It was somewhat stressful.

Also if you have any projects you have done/are doing show them. If you have any kind of portfolio it will aid you immensely.

They will compensate you poorly/probably give you poor equipment, but it doesn't matter. After you have had that job for 4-12 months start applying for other real positions that pay real compensation. Otherwise you will be making less then 15/hr for as long as they can string you along(I know like 3 people that have played/are playing that game). You don't have to leave that company if you get another job, but you will at least be able to negotiate a more reasonable compensation(I advise leaving though). Also consider doing little freelance stuff on the side to build up your resume/portfolio.

Answer 8

Another option is to go the contract route. Find out who the contract agencies are in your area which handle IT or Programming jobs. Put your resume on file with them. When companies need some temporary help, they call these contract companies. Good news is, they often end up hiring the contractors full time. Even if they don't, you learn earn more buzzwords to put on your resume.

Answer 9

You can't get experience without the job and you need experience to get the job. I think that companies have some lofty expectations of graduates sometimes - you're meant to hit the ground running, and this can be difficult given the breadth of a computer science/software engineering course.

The best way I can possibly see to achieve an entry level role is to spend as much time programming as possible prior to graduation. Often the best route into the industry is via an internship/industrial year/gap year which may lead to a job with the same company after graduation. Knowing a language inside out will greatly improve your chances of getting an entry level job also. It's not about breadth of knowledge in this case, it's more about depth. If you show ambition and a real interest in the subject that goes very far...

Oh, and apply directly to companies, not through recruitment agents. Often situations where you're applying directly to people in the IT department prove to be more effective than going through HR and facing ridiculous screening tests.

Answer 10

If you like Stack Overflow, try the jobs listing at Joel on Software. There you will find some simpatico souls with jobs available.

• http://jobs.joelonsoftware.com/

Answer 11

The good jobs weren't on Monster and Craigslist, anyway. If you have a CS degree from a reputable college, you don't want to look there for jobs.

I've had 4 jobs in the many years since I graduated in CS. One of those I got from a Monster-like site (it may have been Monster; I don't remember). It was the worst job ever -- hilariously similar to Office Space.

The other 3 jobs I got by good old fashioned What Color Is Your Parachute (you've read it, right?) footwork: get out and talk to the person you would be working for. (If the CEO and CTO are on your side, you're going to get hired, full stop.) Of course, it doesn't always work, but it works surprisingly often. (Edit: Better still, even when it doesn't work, you get a lot more info out of a CTO telling you "no" than an average interviewer telling you "no".)

This is perhaps a hard lesson to learn coming from college, where everything is in a catalog and you just pick one from the list. But the real world isn't in a catalog. Find something you love, and go fight for it. People respect that. For example, do you love 3D graphics? Write an open-source graphics program, and blog about it.

If you've done any public work -- like an open-source project or a programming blog -- that's a huge bonus. They'll google you, and in 30 seconds they can see all that you've done that sets you apart from Joe Average CS Graduate. The converse is also true: if you don't have any public work, then compared to all your friends with silly open-source projects and blogs, you're an unknown. If you say you love graphics but have nothing to show for it, they're not going to believe you.

Of the software companies here in Seattle, half seem to be firing like crazy, and the other half are hiring like crazy. There's just as much software that needs writing as last year -- or even more, since computer programs are far cheaper than humans. The jobs are still out there -- just not at the same companies as before.

Answer 12

Are there local user group or other similar local communities that you could join and network to see where others are working and how they got their start? Have you tried government sites that may advertise jobs that may be useful? Those would be my suggestion along with trying various recruiting firms like Robert Half International though I'm not sure how much of a Twin Cities presence they have so that may be a bad example that may be able to help you tweak your resume and interviewing skills as Volt did give me a good deal of help in handling Microsoft interviews about 5 years ago now.

Another thought would be to go to other university campuses and see if they have a career services section that may have some references or help even if you didn't go to that school.

Course I graduated 12 years ago but I ended up making a big move when I finally got a job that took me from a city in Southwestern Ontario, Canada to Seattle, Washington, just to give the example of what I did and worked for me though I did have interviews at various other places.

EDIT: Look at Career Advice as another place to ask such questions if you have them.

Answer 13

Run, do not walk, to Ask the Headhunter. Read his book, read his website, and subscribe to his email newsletter. As Ken said, the good jobs aren't on career sites.

Answer 14

Meh.

Companies will hire you if the guys in the interview liked you personally, as long as you have enough skills on your CV that you're not blatantly the wrong choice.

The rule of thumb is that three interviews gives you one offer.

Now ask yourself - of the people I met in life, how many do I like? I think it's about one in three.

You get hired when you happen to have interviewers that you actually get on with socially.

Answer 15

Well I hear the same words about Germany and Europe on the whole, but the reality is that there are almost no jobs for juniors here.

Except maybe consulting/support business where you are expected to travel all the week or constantly relocated from a town to town every few months. Personal life killer. i suppose these jobs are there because nobody wants them (at least for long).

In the recession there will likely be less demand for unqualified craft. Or maybe overly qualified will be deemed too expensive and there will be possibilities for juniors.

By the way, beware Monster. At least its German segments contains a significant amount of noise (job openings when noone is actually needed, just to demonstrate "growth" to stakeholders).

Answer 16

If you are just looking for a programming job, any job, to get your foot in the door, you are single & healthy then you might want to try the contract route, as another poster said - the two biggest tech contract companies that I know about are TekSystems and Volt, and I am sure both have at least one office in the Twin Cities

http://www.teksystems.com/

http://www.volt.com

These guys only make money when you get hired, so they are motivated to get you a job, and they will get you interviews for 6-12 month positions. But they aren't great if you aren't young and healthy because you pay 100% of your health insurance and 100% of your own retirement - so you need to be able to choose the high deductible/limited benefits options to really make it pay.

Answer 17

Check into various user groups and programming groups. Here in Seattle we have the Northwest C++ Users Group, these are good places to meet other tech folk and ask around about opportunities.

Answer 18

Have you had any luck finding a job? I'm also from the twin cities and I will be pursuing a computer science degree from a smaller university than the U of M. Did you happen to go to Metro State Universitiy?

Answer 19

I'm also from Minneapolis....on the whole, I've found the job market here increasingly bad. It seems like more and more of them are mindless corporate dead ends. If you want to use techs that are off the mainstream(even just a little outside the mainstream like scala for example), head west. Hell, I had an interview yesterday and the tech lead that did the interview had never heard of Standard ML, Lisp, or even functional programming in general. And I don't think he was bluffing to test my knowledge.

BTW which school did you graduate from? I'm a '01 SJU alum.

Also to the person going to Metro State next year: Don't. I used to work for MnSCU (the parent org for Minnesota's State College system). We used to call that center of learning 'Stripper U'. Avoid at all costs. Consider another school. You'll be happier.

Sorry to sound so negative.

Answer 20

If you're still in college, look around for summer internships. It's a cheap (for the company) way to see if you and the company belong together. Our last hire had been an intern while he was in college.

Answer 21

Come on, nobody mentionned careers.stackoverflow.com ?